For those interested in flaxseed

CWorthing said:
I am interested in the flax oil conditioning. I took a look at the Cooking Illustrated link and Item #1 in the instructions shows a serious flaw. There are no pores in cast iron. If you heat up cast iron it will expand but it will do so due to the laws of thermodynamics. What we are looking at is thermal expansion and the amount is based on the material which dictates the thermal expansion coefficient and with the change in temperature you can find the difference in size. BUT there are no air spaces left because of that and there are none to begin with. The Crisbee website makes the same error. it won't cause you any problems, it is just unnecessary.

Speaking of Crisbee, I just ordered a "puck" from them and I am going to examine the density of the puck and compare it to the density of Crisco and Beeswax and should be able to come up with a close approximation. Won't be exactly the same but I doubt if that would matter. I just do not want to violate anyone's legal information. I made a mixture of food grade mineral oil and beeswax for use on turned wood bowls that I am messing with.

One other issue and I don't know if any of you have tried this. I see all the lye bath instructions to get rid of rust. There is an old tried and true method to do the same thing. It is called rust bluing, an old standby finishing method of coating firearms. I have been doing that for 30 years as a commercial (although part time) enterprise.

In short, red rust (Fe2O3) is an unstable compound and will continue to "propagate". The simplest way to stop it is to expose it to steam or boiling water for 10 to 20 minutes. Best if the water is distilled. What you create is magnetite (Fe3O4) which is a stable compound. You can then use a stainless brush to remove any scale and it will not continue.
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Thanks CWorthing for your technical insight. Spot on the thermodynamics. Interesting. On a side note, I use Kroil for rust removal on hand tools and similar. Would the variances in CI chemical/metal alloys from manufacturer to manufacturer of old and new iron make in difference in your analysis/explanation? BTW, so far no peeling, flaking or bad odors leaching into food while cooking with my flax seed seasoned skillet experiment.
 
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EC Price,

Cast iron is basically iron, carbon and silicon. Not sure what other items foundries may have added. But under the right conditions, cast iron will rust and if you expose rust to boiling water, or even steam for at least 10 minutes it will change to another stable form and will stop the rust at that spot. You would need to use a loose wire brush to remove any loose particles.
 
CWorthing,

From what I gather, you're supposed to heat and then cool cast iron slowly in order to not warp or crack it, no ? With that said, wouldn't pouring boiling water or submerging a cast iron skillet in boiling water, be asking for trouble ?
 
As far as cast iron is concerned, 212°F is more like warm than hot. Heating the entire pan at once in hot water is akin to heating it in an oven. Warping and cracking are typically the result of heating an empty pan too fast on a hot burner. One part expands rapidly while the rest does not, and therein lies the problem. As long as it's not plunged in cold water at that temp and is allowed to come to room temp on its own, there should be no problem.
 
EC Price,
I did a search and found the recipe for Crisbee that people were using. It was 5 parts Crisco to 1 part beeswax.

I purchased a puck and measured the density of it and found it was .9186 grams per ml (too many places I know). I then measured the density of Crisco and got .817 (very close to what I found on Google) and then I measured some Beeswax I had on hand and got right around .96 grams per ml. A mix of 5 to 1 would be .84 grams per ml and no where near what their product is. It surprised me very much but what I found was 1/3 Crisco to 2/3 Beeswax. I have not mixed up any of it yet but will soon. I have it on a spreadsheet if anyone wants to check the math.
 
CWorthing said:
EC Price,
I did a search and found the recipe for Crisbee that people were using. It was 5 parts Crisco to 1 part beeswax.

I purchased a puck and measured the density of it and found it was .9186 grams per ml (too many places I know). I then measured the density of Crisco and got .817 (very close to what I found on Google) and then I measured some Beeswax I had on hand and got right around .96 grams per ml. A mix of 5 to 1 would be .84 grams per ml and no where near what their product is. It surprised me very much but what I found was 1/3 Crisco to 2/3 Beeswax. I have not mixed up any of it yet but will soon. I have it on a spreadsheet if anyone wants to check the math.
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Ok thanks CWorthing. So, you are saying that 1/3 Crisco and 2/3 Beeswax will yield a density of approximately .9186 that would approximate Crisbee? And where can I find food grade beeswax? A particular brand? Btw, the flax oil I am using in my experiment is the Whole Foods house brand. It is 100% pure, organic and filtered. Not sure what filtered means as opposed to the unfiltered type. Blended flax oil with other ingredients will not work. But anyway so far in my experiment, no issues of bad, leeching tastes from cooking, flaking or peeling. A few caveats: There is a little "smoking" or more like evaporation maybe of the flax oil on the first initial application on bare iron. As I progressed along on subsequent coats, there was less "smoking". And, I used the maximum oven temperature of my stove at 550 F. The iron I am using in my experiment is a new manufactured Lodge 10-1/2 in skillet I purchased a few years ago. The reason I used this piece of iron is that I wanted to use it often and try to smooth out the rough interior with frequent use instead of using mechanical means. All the rest of my old iron I use Crisbee and the interior surfaces are relatively slick compared to new Lodge. The slickest interior of any old iron I have ever seen or used is a 100 year old Wagner #8 in my collection. Interior surface is literally slick as glass.
 
I did some net research this last winter on "food grade beeswax" and basically found that there is no standard for it. Well you see it so labeled, the seller is gilding the lily. Organic has a "standard" that is not really achievable or more accurately verifiable. It requires that the hives are placed so that they are not near any place that uses pesticides. The bee keepers admit that they have no way of knowing that or even knowing where and how far their bees travel. There is nothing in the wax that is going to do any harm to you. .

I have had my best luck obtaining beeswax on Craigs list. I a few pounds last winter in Peoria AZ for $7 a pound. If you wanted to get it raw and clean it yourself, you can get it cheaper. Forget trying to get it from a bee keeper for pocket change as it is a nice money maker bi product of their business. You can also get it at Amazon but will pay more for it,

Cleaning it is not that big a chore. Easiest way is the put it in a container of water and boil it. The beeswax will melt and the debris will sink to the bottom. Or most of it will. You can then sieve it after you melt it again and make it cleaner. A LOT easier to buy it clean.

Easiest way is to buy it cleaned and the bees wax I got in AZ was very clean. Found another source in western WA and will be over that way next week and going to pick more up. I use it with food grade Mineral Oil to make a balm to treat wood bowls and cutting boards.
 
Sorry, I did not answer your first question. Yes, using one third Crisco and two thirds beeswax will give you a density of .9186 that is the same as Crisbee, or close enough.
 
CWorthing said:
Sorry, I did not answer your first question. Yes, using one third Crisco and two thirds beeswax will give you a density of .9186 that is the same as Crisbee, or close enough.
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So, I'm wondering if this same ratio would work using lard (instead of Crisco) with beeswax?

Thanks,
Donna
 
DLipscomb said:
So, I'm wondering if this same ratio would work using lard (instead of Crisco) with beeswax?

Thanks,
Donna
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I dunno, but you could just experiment with it just as I am with flax oil. Just start out with a small batch of it, test it on just one piece of iron. But, make sure the iron is completely cleaned and stripped to bare metal before starting your experiment.
 
CWorthing said:
Sorry, I did not answer your first question. Yes, using one third Crisco and two thirds beeswax will give you a density of .9186 that is the same as Crisbee, or close enough.
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CW - I tried mixing this blend recently and it seems to look like and seems to be close if not exact to the Crisbee formula. I used 2 pucks of 1.5 oz of Big Dipper Beeswax to 1.5 oz of Crisco/storebrand shortening. I melted all 3 in a small saucepan an pour mixture into a Mason jar with measure markings. It yielded 5-1/2 fluid ozs after it cooled and hardened.

---------- Post added at 09:14 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:12 AM ----------
EC_Price said:
Flaxseed does not seem to be too popular here, but for those interested in trying flaxseed oil, I found this recently and if you prefer flaxseed oil, give it a try. FWIW >

https://www.cooksillustrated.com/how_tos/5820-the-ultimate-way-to-season-cast-iron
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So far in my experiment I started earlier this year, no flaking, chipping, or leeched odor of the flax seed oil seasoning into food when cooking. :chuckle:
 
EC_Price said:
CW - I tried mixing this blend recently and it seems to look like and seems to be close if not exact to the Crisbee formula. I used 2 pucks of 1.5 oz of Big Dipper Beeswax to 1.5 oz of Crisco/storebrand shortening. I melted all 3 in a small saucepan an pour mixture into a Mason jar with measure markings. It yielded 5-1/2 fluid ozs after it cooled and hardened.

---------- Post added at 09:14 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:12 AM ----------




So far in my experiment I started earlier this year, no flaking, chipping, or leeched odor of the flax seed oil seasoning into food when cooking. :chuckle:
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Do you have any pictures of your flax seed oil experiment? I found a piece that has an impeccable finish on it and I was leaning towards a flax seed oil seasoning as a guess. It would be interesting to see what your piece looks like, either immediately after treatment or as of now.
 
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